☐ Genocide and things stay pretty much the same
☐ Extra genocide and things get worse
☐ Waste vote (get extra genocide anyway)
“Democracy”
Its almost like money and first past the post elections only serve to narrow down political options.
But now you can stay at Trump hotel, Gaza! Think of the amenities!
I can see the golf course now, wasting more water than Nestle just to keep the greens in shape.
Extra genocide? It’s the same amount of genocide…
People should be free to vote for who best represents them while still counting their vote if their preference didn’t win.
Passing state level electoral reform will not only empower the creation of stronger 3rd parties, but also force the legacy political parties to have to compete and actually represent people.
No more safe seats, no more hostage situation, no more voting while holding our noses, only democracy. More democracy was always going to be the solution to this problem. Who could possibly be against more democracy?
Videos on Electoral Reform
First Past The Post voting (What most states use now)
Videos on alternative electoral systems we can try out.
RCV please
While I agree that first past the post is the worst possible option, we need national reform as well.
STAR or RCV has the potential to break the 2 party system where votes are counted, but it comes up short against the electoral college system. As long as the electoral college is how we choose our President we will only have 2 viable candidates and the parties will have elevated power to not only choose our candidates but to elevate their preferred down ballot candidates which hobbles alternative voting mechanisms.
The electoral college combined with citizens United gives the parties practically unchecked power.
I’m wondering what the best path forward is… it doesn’t seem likely to pass in either Texas or Florida, but sometimes purple states will surprise you. Backup plan is getting ballot measures in enough of the smaller states to make up the same number of electors. The captured SCOTUS would probably shoot it down somehow, but I think enough people would literally riot in the street over that that they’d at least think twice about it.
National reform will only happen from the bottom up. Need to change the local elections first and push every incumbent out of their seats. The current people in power will never cede.
France has a runoff for president
Whoa, either they’re incredibly unaware of the recent news in Gaza or this is quite mask off about their side and goals. “the moral stain of reelecting genocide”? Give me a fucking break, the conflict was self-resolving right before Trump’s inauguration. Now he’s fanning the flames.
It’s all about perception. There’s plenty of people living in a generational walled garden. They don’t see your discourse. They don’t see consenting discourse. They see the infallible word of their chosen demagogue. End of story.
the conflict was self-resolving
Peak liberal delusion.
Not that delusional, the genocide was running in a pretty steady pace.
Wait, so how is letting Trump get elected a win for those who oppose genocide?
Opposing genocide is a losing battle to begin with. A political movement organized around a policy, changing policy was resolutely rejected, and the movement was crushed.
It would be more accurate to say letting Trump win was preferred over opposing genocide than the other way around.
“To cut off your own nose to spite the face” is the only thing that comes to mind here.
He has yet to stop the genocide for that to hold a colander’ worth of water.
In fact, he wants to take over Gaza and kick ALL the Palestinians out. And people STILL make the argument that a vote NOT for Kamala was somehow opposing genocide. It was never on referendum, for any of the candidates.
While her statement is over reaching, she does have a valid point. It will be easier to raise a resistance against trump than harris. This of course benefits her the most if that resistance can vote for her and her party. But it is still a valid point among the spin.
Not sure how when the media, social media, including the new tech (ai), is all in the pocket of trump (or vise versa it doesn’t really matter).
We might have decades of authoritarian rule on our hands. I don’t think sacrificing our neighbors was particularly worth the hope that somehow fascists are easier to fight than liberals. Maybe if you’re a certain demographic. For the rest of us? Fucked.
Alex, can I have “What total fucking moron might say”, for $500?
Congratulations, the baby was thrown out with the bathwater and now there is a guy that wants to take over Gaza and kick ALL the Palestinians out. But hey, at least it’s not a woman in the oval office.
Fucking equivocating bullshit, I hope people her didn’t vote for Kamala because of the BULLSHIT argument about genocide, as if that was going to be ANY fucking different under Trump, get what they fucking deserve. It hasn’t even been 30 days yet and it looks like they will. Way to go, fucking morons.
I don’t think Jason Call goes by “she”. Or are you referring to some statement by Jill Stein?
Yeah libs are suddenly waking up to all kinds of problems. They just found out that a genocide started on inauguration day.
Hey, look, it’s [90% of the people I argued with on Lemmy before election day]!
And it’s now 90% quieter. Hmmm.
Genocide Joe stans seething over at .world
I missed you guys! Now after the ethnic cleansing are you going to stay at the Trump Hotel in Gaza or the Trump Resort? It will have golf!
Reasonable people are opposing this genocide instead of smugly cheering it on.
Well, when Trump makes it worse by trying to kick the Palestinians out and take over the Gaza strip himself, you can stay at home and feel smug about keeping a woman out of the oval office.
Don’t you see? Having the US go from sponsor to active participant in the genocide is actually better than giving a cogent and competent woman the oval office.
/s
I can walk and chew gum.
Give me a fucking break. You people are just the goddamned worst.
Great point.
Those literally don’t exist, what are you talking about?
Check the other replies.
Russian stooge says what?
If a protest could work under trump why wouldn’t it work under Harris?
Very true, this guy is a dumb ass.
Because trump won’t take over Gaza and turn it into a casino strip…hang on a minute…
Assuming he is sincere, then I’d assume that he would say that it’s not “their” protests at that point but the participation of others.
Under Harris, they stay isolated without energized allies as most people are relieved with the status quo. They hope that Trump pushes things so far to perhaps even cancel elections and trigger a violent uprising that opens the door for them to ultimately win and that is their opportunity to finally replace the status quo. A very dangerous game where a more likely outcome is a far right authoritarian state with lots of suffering and lives at stake, but that’s a risk they are glad for everyone to take.
You see this in their rhetoric, that it’s not their fault for failing to support a viable alternative to Trump, it’s everyone else’s fault for failing to agree with them, and maybe now everyone will learn their lesson and agree with them.
I’ve had conversations with them and they hold that democracy is the wrong way. Essentially they think the citizenry are too stupid and/or lazy to decide how things should be governed. This is pretty much the horseshoe effect, both the far right and far left want to replace the democratic system with something else. If someone doesn’t 100% agree with them, they must be wrong and their perspective must be ignored, and democracy means actually trying to work with such people. So they prefer to take their chances with prodding a violent conflict since they’ve figured they can never win peacefully. If they can’t have the presidency, then who cares. No patience for capturing local and legislative offices.
The far right was more effective strategically, playing the game until they could unleash. They played the game with the republican party according to the rules, and then won.
Essentially they think the citizenry are too stupid and/or lazy to decide how things should be governed.
Well… Yes. This is more or less true. But that’s an argument to increase education and engagement, not to discard the whole system.
I think the education is tricky, as you have competing interests and you have people countering education by calling it indoctrination. A huge part of the foundation for the situation today started with the conservative radio shows and fox news stepping up to start undermining education, to eventual great effect.
The engagement I kind of have the opposite view. If you can’t be bothered to understand the candidates and the issues, then you shouldn’t feel pressure to vote.A lot of engagement efforts say “you should be ashamed if you don’t vote, it doesn’t matter how you vote but just vote”. If you are there to just “mark your team” or fill in the ballot according to whatever person hands you a pre-filled “ballot guide” on the way in the door, maybe don’t sweat voting. Voting for an outcome without any effort to understand the consequences of that vote is worse than abstaining from a vote.
I can understand there are a lot of races, and my response is that there would be no shame in voting only for the races you can educate yourself about. A partial ballot is fine.
you’d think that would be the obvious mindset people who “care about human dignity” would have, right?
i think their argument would be that conditions will materially worsen for a significant propirtion of the population, escalating the chances of the working class to become conscious of their chains.
idk tho
Which is stupid. The Republicans crashed the world economy in 2008, destroying 40% of working people’s wealth, and were only out of power for 2 years.
Accelerationists gotta accelerate
I think it’s also the unwillingness of the left to accept “baby steps” towards a goal. The right is perfectly happy to inch towards their endgame and it’s working.
This is always my biggest gripe too. Even if the right doesn’t “win,” they take whatever they can get and they hold on to it. They’ll put players in every position and strike together and often. There were tons of interviews of concervatives saying, “I don’t agree on x, but I like y, so I’m voting for Trump.” A lot of the left is “if I can’t get literally every single thing I want right now, then I don’t care if it all burns down.”
As a example, look at slavery. Slavery is abhorrent, but we didn’t stop because we weren’t getting it all. Only half of the country allows us to be free? Alright, we’re running north and we will keep fighting. We learned how to read in poorly funded schools, we sat at colored only tables, we got lesser medical care, lesser resources, but we knew that every small battle was getting closer to winning the war. Yes, it’s painstakingly slow, but we did what we had to do to keep moving. Yeah, Harris was not our savior. She had/has issues, but she also seemed like she wouldn’t be doing, well… gestures wildly.
Agreed. I didn’t hear much if any grumbling from the US conservative base in the decades before Roe was overturned toward their politicians, provided that politician opposed abortion. It was enough they believed the “correct” thing and did what they could within the restrictions of the law, until process aligned in their favor via convenient Supreme Court vacancies.
1000% this
Okay, that’s is succinctly profound.
Don’t let a perfect plan get in the way of a good plan.
I’ve been pondering about this for an hour. Err. Idk. Yes. No. Maybe. Kinda yes I suppose?
Oh well, back to racoons and owls.
deleted by creator
I’d take that as a confession to being complicit whenever we get to the US equivalent of the Nuremberg trials.
Well, Nuremberg was the heart of Nazi rule, so I guess the US version will be at Mar-a-Lago.
What about the moral stain of ethnic cleansing?
Yeah, didn’t you hear the news, Gaza is saved!
Oh wait…
“Were going to not elect genocide by electing ultra-genocide!”
🤔
Sounds like the voting system needs an overhaul if those are your two options don’t ya think?
Absolutely, but plunging the US deeper into fascism is not going to help with that. When you’re in a hole, stop digging.
“ps, don’t look at our policy concerning Ukraine.”
