Reposting this meme because is too radical for 196 apparently
How to make sure the fascist wins: get liberals to vote third party.
How to get a fascist on the ballot in the first place: keep voting for the conservative Democrat.
How to make that relevant again: Get a time machine.
The fascists are already on the ballot, in case anybody missed that detail.
I swear, this stuff barely played back when it seemed like an idle concern of the politically inclined. Today it seems entirely detached from reality.
But hey, by all means, absolutely get the kind of reform that would make this make sense again. I want a world in which this thread doesn’t feel like either disingenuous trolling, a conservative psyop or entirely delusional. I want a world where Americans can vote for multiple parties and get proper coalitions and stuff.
But seriously, until that point, just vote for whoever the Democrat is.
If someone is in a swing state? Sure, vote for whoever the Democrats put up. But I think it’s important to acknowledge that the Democrats are part of the problem here, not the solution. Do the Democrats want multiple parties and proper coalitions? They do not. They actively fight against those things. Anyone who blindly votes Democrat in any of the majority of states that are solidly red or blue is making the situation worse.
Anyone who blindly votes, and doesn’t give strong, consistent, repeated feedback to the representative once elected, is making the situation worse. FTFY
This. There is zero chance of creating change by voting for a third party selectively in a FPTP system.
Electoral systems are known to be extremely stable because all the power is in the hands of people who benefit from the current system, again by definition. Crucially, it doesn’t matter WHO they are, if they won with this system, they are for this system.
To get electoral reform you need those who benefit to find it either ethically important or politically expedient to enact reform. Right now is actually a good time to start bringing up that issue, because one has to assume there is a growing realization in Democrats and at least a segment of semi-reasonable conservatives that the current system is exposed to very, very bad things in a short timeframe.
So if the US is going to get electoral reform done without going through the process of setting the country, and subsequently the planet, on fire you need a) a Dem in power, and b) a massive consensus and outright downpour of activist pressure for this on every level of government. Probably forever, seeing how the entire rest of the system is a mess, but baby steps.
It’s not radical at all. It’s just ineffectual, unfortunately.
Yeah, why don’t the other 30 million people just change the way they do it?
Because you can’t get a message out to all 300million people normally, let alone when there are billions of dollars of propaganda working against you is very difficult. Because even if a US 3rd parties were to gain significant power they don’t have the institutional knowledge to even keep the lights on, whichever opposition would eat them alive. Because if they did somehow manage to get momentum and take over they would immediately develop the exact same problems of previous political parties because these are systemic problems with your political system.
Why not invest in a strategy that doesn’t makes things even worse when you fail. Political reform that would allow 3+ parties to exist are just as big of a long shot as getting a third party elected, but it doesn’t split the vote and actually fixes the problem long term.
But hey I’m not an American, I have 5 viable parties to choose from. so you do you.
This is an extremely naive take. Most people will vote for the party they have always voted for.
Can someone please explain? Does the US only have two political parties? That sounds horrendously undemocratic. I know next to nothing about US politics so I may be wrong.
Edit: Also, why is one party called “Democratic” and the other “Republican”? Does this make the Republican party non-democratic? Is this a non-official naming scheme that people created or does seriously only one of them support democracy? Thank you for the answers :)
For all practical purposes yes. It sucks, but as you can see, speaking about third parties gets most people pissed off as it’s considered voter suicide / throwing away your vote to vote for an extremely minor third party candidate. The financial support within these two power house parties makes it unlikely this system will ever change. As someone pointed out here, a systematic change like ranked choice voting where third parties could aggregate credit without forcing voters to abandon the two parties they are comfortable with would be the only hope of moving away from the bullshit 2 party system. However, that’s not in the interest of the two parties that already run the government, so never going to happen at scale at least.
Let’s refine your comment.
In a majority rules, representative democracy, the peoples’ voice is heard through electing officials that promise to vote on behalf of the constituents.
This is seen to good effect in the legislative branch, where specific candidates hold office for short terms. But as empirical data suggests, the two party system is still relied upon, especially when it comes to less-than-ideally informed voters.
When it comes to presidential candidates, who wield far greater power over longer terms, voters are averse to the risk of giant, sweeping changes.
There have been numerous popular third-party candidates vying for the presidency, but none that sufficiently capture a voter base. So, therefore it is equated to throwing the vote away
But imo, long live Bernie. I would have voted with my soul
Nope that’s not a refinement, thats just a new comment.
As far as less than ideally informed voters, that’s a self fulfilling prophecy - why become informed when there are two parties and you are programmed to already hate one? You just vote and party lines and move on. Politicians in the US don’t even have platforms anymore, they don’t need to.
- Get rid of gerrymandering by forcing convex districts
- Get rid of first past the post
Put simply - we have two parties, both are right wing, and while we have an established way for third parties to gain more proper/fair inclusion in the system (like debate participation, ballot access, in some cases funding) anytime a third party comes close to meeting the requirements the 2 parties mutually agree to raise the bar.
Why not get rid of First Past the Post voting, implement Ranked Choice / Alternative voting, and then we won’t have to fucking have this conversation at all?
Let me know when that happens
That’s how people feel about the idea proposal in your meme, lol
ETA I agree the two party is stupid but unfortunately getting “everyone to start voting third party” has never worked every time it’s brought up
It’s happening now. Some states have implemented a system already and Nevada is voting on it next election.
