Cowbee [he/they]

Actually, this town has more than enough room for the two of us

He/him or they/them, doesn’t matter too much

Marxist-Leninist ☭

Interested in Marxism-Leninism? Check out my “Read Theory, Darn it!” introductory reading list!

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Joined 1 year ago
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Cake day: December 31st, 2023

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  • Don’t know where you got “1 million executions.” No more than 700,000 were condemned to death, and of those condemned many had their sentences reduced. Even if all 700,000 were killed, that still fits what I have actually said, you’ve been putting words in my mouth. Moreover, you’ll want to read this excerpt from the book The Triumph of Evil, specifically page 74:

    The claim that Stalin and other Soviet leaders killed millions (Conquest, 1990) also appears to be wildly exaggerated. More recent evidence from the Soviet archives opened up by the anticommunist Yeltsin government indicate that the total number of death sentences (including of both existing prisoners and those outside captivity) over the 1921-1953 interval (covering the period of Stalin’s partial and complete rule) was between 775,866 and 786,098 (Getty, Rittersporn, and Zemskov, 1993). Given that the archive data originates from anti-Stalin (and even anticommunist) sources, it is extremely unlikely that they underestimate the true number (Thurston, 1996). In addition, the Soviet Union has long admitted to executing at least 12,733 people between 1917 and 1921, mostly during the Foreign Interventionist Civil War of 1918-22, although it is possible that as many as 40,000 more may have been executed unofficially (Andics, 1969).

    These data would seem to imply about 800,000 executions. The figure of 800,000 may greatly overestimate the number of actual executions, as it includes many who were sentenced to death but who were not actually caught or who had their sentences reduced (Getty, Rittersporn, and Zemskov, 1993). In fact, Vinton (1993) has provided evidence indicating that the number of executions was significantly below the number of civilian prisoners sentenced to death in the Soviet Union, with only 7,305 executions in a sample of 11,000 prisoners authorized to be executed in 1940 (or scarcely 600/o ). In addition, most (681,692) of the 780,000 or so death sentences passed under Stalin were issued during the 1937-38 period (Getty, Ritterspom, and Zemskov, 1993), when Soviet paranoia about foreign subversion reached its zenith due to a 1936 alliance between Nazi Germany and fascist Japan that was specifically directed against the Soviet Union (Manning, 1993) and due to a public 1936 resolution by a group of influential anti-Stalin foreigners (the Fourth International which was allied with the popular but exiled Russian dissident Leon Trotsky) advocating the overthrow of the Soviet government by illegal means (Glotzer, 1968).

    Stalin initially set a cap of 186,500 imprisonments and 72,950 death penalties for a 1937 special operation to combat this threat that was to be carried out by local 3-man tribunals called ''troikas" (Getty, Ritterspom, and Zemskov, 1993). As the tribunals passed death sentences before the accused had even been arrested, local authorities requested increases in their own quotas (Knight, 1993), and there was an official request in 1938 for a doubling of the amount of prisoner transport that had been initially requisitioned to carry out the original campaign “quotas” of the tribunals (Getty, Ritterspom, and Zemskov, 1993). However, even if there had been twice as many actual • executions as originally planned, the number would still be less than 150,000. Many of those sentenced by the tribunals may have escaped capture, and many more may have had their death sentence refused or revoked by higher authorities before arrest/execution could take place, especially since Stalin later realized that excesses had been committed in the 1937-38 period, had a number of convictions overturned, and had many of the responsible local leaders punished (Thurston, 1996)."

    This is why relying exclusively on Wikipedia is silly, do some actual reading. A solid rule of thumb with respect to any Wikipedia article on enemies of the US is to look at where the figures and sources come from and analyze them yourself, as you can see Wikipedia made the error of conflating condemnations with executions.


  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.mltoMemes@lemmy.mlEvery comrades' wish
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    7 hours ago

    Hand wave what away? Everything I have said is consistent with what we historically know about the Soviet Union. Can you point to something you believe I disagree with? Just linking Wikipedia articles doesn’t actually constitute an argument, do you think I am denying that the Great Purge happened at all?

    Touch grass, please.


  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.mltoMemes@lemmy.mlEvery comrades' wish
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    7 hours ago

    “Purging” normally meant “expulsion from Party membership” and carried no actual punishment. For criminals who were purged, that also included jail time or even execution. The myth that everyone purged was executed comes from the Black Book of Communism, anti-communist mythology that the creators have since denounced, and even included Nazis killed during World War II as “victims of Communism.”

    You can feel free to read history books like the ones I have linked.


  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.mltoMemes@lemmy.mlEvery comrades' wish
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    8 hours ago

    Removing fascists from government is fascist?

    Supporting democracy is equivalent to supporting genocide?

    Supporting a popular movement to remove fascists from government is equivalent to supporting genocide?

    I’m convinced you don’t actually read what you write at all, this is incredibly silly behavior. You’re even wrong about candidates needing to be “pre-approved,” that was true in some cases and false in others, and even if it was true in all cases it doesn’t mean popular support for removing fascists is somehow support for genocide.

    Seriously, touch grass. You don’t have to read, or learn about history, as long as you make an effort to touch grass at this point.


  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.mltoMemes@lemmy.mlEvery comrades' wish
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    8 hours ago

    They weren’t fascist in any sense. Your point isn’t based on historical fact at all, you just kept linking Wikipedia articles when I was giving you sources Wikipedia cites. It was in no way the “exact same autocracy authoritarian government” or anything of the sort, you literally said fascists should have been allowed in government even when the citizens supported the purges.

    This is historical nihilism, you don’t care about history, you care about being right.


  • Certainly less authoritarian than Tsarism, Capitalism, or fascism, didn’t have a dictatorial leader, genuinely served the interests of the individual and the collective, and reduced regimentation of society and the economy compared to Tsarism, Capitalism, and fascism. The only point you have was the millitarism.

    Again, read Blackshirts and Reds. The Communists and fascists were entirely antagonistic and served different classes, the Communists served the proletariat while the fascists served the bourgeoisie.

    The political orthodoxy that demonizes communism permeates the entire political perspective. Even people on the Left have internalized the liberal/conservative ideology that equates fascism and communism as equally evil totalitarian twins, two major mass movements of the twentieth century. This book attempts to show the enormous differences between fascism and communism both past and present, both in theory and practice, especially in regard to questions of social equality, private capital accumulation, and class interest.

    The orthodox mythology also would have us believe that the Western democracies (with the United States leading the way) have opposed both totalitarian systems with equal vigor. In fact, U.S. leaders have been dedicated above all to making the world safe for global corporate investment and the private profit system. Pursuant of this goal, they have used fascism to protect capitalism, while claiming to be saving democracy from communism.

    In the pages ahead I discuss how capitalism propagates and profits from fascism, the value of revolution in the advancement of the human condition, the causes and effects of the destruction of communism, the continuing relevance of Marxism and class analysis, and the heartless nature of corporate-class power.

    Read it, you need to understand history.



  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.mltoMemes@lemmy.mlEvery comrades' wish
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    9 hours ago

    The Proletariat is the people indeed, and the people supported the purges. They had already spent years in a civil war against the Tsarists, were invaded by 14 Capitalist nations, and fascists in Nazi Germany were killing Communists from day 1. The re-introduction of Capitalism resulted in 7 million excess deaths.

    Yes, Monarchism, Capitalism, and fascism are worthless.


  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.mltoMemes@lemmy.mlEvery comrades' wish
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    9 hours ago

    Fascism, Capitalism, and Monarchism should be allowed within a Socialist system why? The economy was far more democratic than under the Tsars or under the current Russian Federation. Democracy doesn’t have to include freedom for fascists, the bougeoisie, or monarchists, and in fact shouldn’t for the Proletariat to have full control.



  • I don’t know if you’ve picked up on this or not, but I’m a Marxist, I’ve seen the Wikipedia pages for everything you’ve linked, and actually read beyond Wikipedia. One of the books I linked, Soviet Democracy, is even listed as a source on Wikipedia’s page on Soviet Democracy (go figure).

    Either way, liberals, fascists, and Tsarists were indeed kicked out of the party, imprisoned, or sentenced to death, depending on the severity of their crimes.

    I really don’t know what point you’re trying to make here, I already openly stated that the Soviet Union wasn’t a mythical wonderland, my position is that it was Socialist and working towards Communism, none of which you seem to have contested. What are you trying to get at?



  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.mltoMemes@lemmy.mlEvery comrades' wish
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    10 hours ago

    There are quite a few errors in your comment, both from a historical perspective and Marxist theory perspective.

    1. The USSR was democratic. The ability to choose between parties is less important than the ability to influence policy. The Soviets practiced Soviet Democracy, as elaborated on in the infographic below and the book Soviet Democracy by Pat Sloan.

    1. As a consequence of the Soviet form of democracy, “dictatorship” doesn’t really apply.

    2. In Marxist theory, the path to Communism is full centralization of the Means of Production. Marx didn’t invent Communism and work backwards, he analyzed Capitalism’s trajectory towards full centralization and monopoly, and thought that as industry advances it must grow in complexity and size. The State in the Soviet Union was controlled by the Proletariat. The “stateless” aspect of Communism refers to the stage in Socialism where a global Socialist economy is achieved, and all production is in the public sector, meaning no armies are needed or any laws upholding class distinctions like Private Property rights or the police that uphold them.

    The Soviet Union wasn’t Anarchist, it was never trying to work towards full decentralization.




  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.mltoMemes@lemmy.mlEvery comrades' wish
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    10 hours ago

    Socialism doesn’t mean “utopia,” it’s a Mode of Production. Either way, there were a number of factors working in West Germany’s favor over East Germany that don’t have to deal with the Mode of Production:

    1. East Germany was made to pay reparations for the immense damage the Nazis dealt to the USSR (80% of combat with the Nazis was on the Eastern Front). West Germany was kept largely unaccountable.

    2. West Germany had almost all of Germany’s industry, the East Germans had to industrialize and pay reparations.

    3. East Germany provided free, high quality education, whereas West Germany did not, but paid higher wages. An effective tactic was to lure educated workers from East Germany over to the West, essentially subsidizing education in the West.

    All of these factors contributed to serious economic problems more caused by circumstance than Socialism.


  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.mltoMemes@lemmy.mlEvery comrades' wish
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    11 hours ago

    Don’t know what you’re trying to say with “it wasn’t,” it was absolutely a Socialist state working towards Communism. I never said it was heaven on Earth either, in fact I linked a critique of the USSR from a Marxist perspective that doesn’t dogmatically reject or uphold it. The USSR was real Socialism, that doesn’t mean it was heaven or hell.