Image transcript:

Calvin (from Calvin & Hobbes) sitting at a lemonade stand, smiling, with a sign that reads, “Trains and micromobility are inevitably the future of urban transportation, whether society wants it or not. CHANGE MY MIND.”

  • Blackmist@feddit.uk
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    26
    arrow-down
    9
    ·
    1 year ago

    The future of transportation is no transportation.

    How many car miles could be saved each year if people didn’t have to go to the office to do their jobs? We were already most of the way there.

    • austin@aussie.zone
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      29
      arrow-down
      5
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      That… is silly. Things need to move.

      So you expect us to live in a virtual pod with a treadmill and grow all of our own food? And collect rainwater?

      Edit: I’m not saying we shouldn’t reduce our need for freight. Growing food in your backyard (half of my yard is good production) reduces the need for freight emissions. And I cycle to work. But drive or fly on holidays, I wish we had a more reliable train network.

      • Franzia@lemmy.blahaj.zone
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        6
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        They said transporation, not freight. I think they mean you can access everything on foot. But just for your heresay against the pod, your pod was made 10% smaller and your treadmill was made 10% faster.

        • imPastaSyndrome@lemm.ee
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          5
          arrow-down
          1
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          Freight is just thing transportation, It’s a subcategory so it’s not like it’s not included. It’s silly to act like it’s stupid to think it is.

      • sarmale@lemmy.zip
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        1 year ago

        That point maybe wasn’t very good, probably saying that offices should be closer (also work from home)

      • calzone_gigante@lemmy.eco.br
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        4
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        How far and how often is the key, on a well planned city people should live close to their jobs and recreational areas, taking away people commuting to work and grouping people with similar destinations together you can solve traffic and give people more mobility.

    • SMITHandWESSON@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      18
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      Not everyone works in an office. Construction, trades, and utility works still need vehicles to work on and create infrastructure out and indoors.

      You’ll also have tons of people in rural area like farmers and ranchers that still need vehicles.

      That being said most of those vehicles will be electric soon. My company will be moving to electric starting in 3 years.

      PS: I’m a utility worker, and we take our work vehicles home foe weather emergencies, so the transportation line is a little blurred for me

      • Blackmist@feddit.uk
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        9
        ·
        1 year ago

        Yeah, you still need to transport items, and people that do things with their hands, but surely in most first world countries, these things are a minority of road traffic.

        If you can get those chokepoints out the way, from dystopian 10 lane traffic jams to an overcrowded tube train, everything else would run so much smoother.

        • SMITHandWESSON@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          I would totally love not to be in a traffic jam, especially while on the clock as I don’t get paid for the drive time to and from work.

        • uis@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Yeah, you still need to transport items,

          Well, cargo bikes are a thing. You can transport whole fridge there.

      • uis@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Construction, trades, and utility works still need vehicles to work on and create infrastructure out and indoors.

        That didn’t stop people before cars. Back then people built small railways if we are talking about construction.

        farmers and ranchers that still need vehicles.

        They need specialized equipment. They need heavy equipment.

        That being said most of those vehicles will be electric soon.

        A car is a car. Another motor doesn’t turn car into magic.

        • SMITHandWESSON@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          That didn’t stop people before cars. Back then people built small railways if we are talking about construction.

          We wouldn’t be having this conversation if it weren’t for vehicles like mine keeping up the internet infrastructure up.

          There’s also no fucking way you going to put train tracks everywhere to keep up infrastructure. That sounds really fucking stupid

          They need specialized equipment. They need heavy equipment.

          This statement makes me feel like I’m responding to a 14 yr old with no life experience. Not even going to bother answering it.

          A car is a car. Another motor doesn’t turn car into magic.

          Electric vehicles have no emissions so there’s no reason people can’t use them specifically for work.

          PS: You can respond but I’m not going to bother with you. There’s no point in having a discussion with someone with illrational and militant about their ideals

          • uis@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            There’s also no fucking way you going to put train tracks everywhere to keep up infrastructure.

            There’s also no fucking way you going to put ashphalt everywhere to keep up infrastructure.

            That sounds really fucking stupid

            Yep. Didn’t stop from building roads.

            Electric vehicles have no emissions so there’s no reason people can’t use them specifically for work.

            You are correct, vehicles. Car is not the only type of vehicle, it’s one of many. And what I was saying emissions is not the only problem of car.

            You can respond but I’m not going to bother with you

            Ok.

            There’s no point in having a discussion with someone with illrational and militant about their ideals

            Indeed. See, there are topics we agree upon.

        • jj4211@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          That didn’t stop people before cars.

          Standard of living was much much worse back then.

          They need specialized equipment.

          They also need to get to stores and see friends and family. Asking people to go back to insular homebound living for farm living seems unreasonable.

          Another motor doesn’t turn car into magic.

          However, if electric, it’s no exhaust, options for flexible energy sources, and hopefully long lived and recyclable batteries. If you are more upset about cars getting in the way of walking, then enjoy the walkable communities that exist today. Unfortunately they tend to be pricey.

          • uis@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            1
            ·
            1 year ago

            They also need to get to stores

            Well, ok. On farms cars at least make some sense.

            However, if electric, it’s no exhaust, options for flexible energy sources, and hopefully long lived and recyclable batteries.

            Yes, but they still take space, instane car infrastructure is still there and crashes still happen.

    • supercriticalcheese@feddit.it
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      5
      ·
      1 year ago

      What about groceries, various errands? it’s definitely not just going to the office is the only reason people get around with cars.

      • Franzia@lemmy.blahaj.zone
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        Basically in countries with more micromobility, they have smaller grocery stores. There will be one on every corner and you can just walk to it.

        I see you mentioned suburbs. Yeah. The thing keeping shops and homes far apart in that case is zoning laws. And also building code dictating single family housing. In a more dense suburb in amsterdam or chicago you might have some rowhouse apartments but the first floor will be for shops, and one of those shops willcbe your nearest grocery store.

      • roo@lemmy.one
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        It’s a discussion about the bulk of transport and commutes. Distributors don’t need to follow a centralised system.

        • supercriticalcheese@feddit.it
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          You still need to drive to do all these things, that’s often a considerable distance though if you live in suburban areas since everything is far away.

          • SwingingTheLamp@midwest.social
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            2
            ·
            1 year ago

            One argument that keeps coming up in favor of cars that the United States is big. Well, if it’s big, we have plenty of room to build things close to where people live. It’s only zoning laws that force things to be unnecessarily far away.

            • supercriticalcheese@feddit.it
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              2
              ·
              1 year ago

              Yes that was my point, not that we need cargo trams.

              And it’s not just US that has this issue although there is taken to the extreme.

              Many suburban areas in Europe have the same issues but the advantage is that many of them were built around small villages that they have ballooned so there was something that could give local services for residents already.

              • SwingingTheLamp@midwest.social
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                2
                ·
                1 year ago

                Good point! I usually hear sincere arguments that we have to drive because everything is so far apart, and so I took it the wrong way. My apologies.

      • uis@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Trains(or cargo trams if you want fancy) for delivery to store and your eleven for delivery from store to home. Or ebike. Or bus.

    • Franzia@lemmy.blahaj.zone
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      4
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      You make a good point but it’s hard to agree. I don’t like home, and would prefer not to work in my own home. I want to see the world, I like to travel. Perhaps if my life had more social mobility I wouldn’t be so starved for literal mobility. I have a car, could go drive anywhere. But it’s not real freedom.

      • Blackmist@feddit.uk
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        12
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        LLMs are not AI.

        If you can train an AI to take the stream of nonsense I am given on a daily basis, and not only turn it into software but also the software they needed rather than what they actually described, then that AI is fucking welcome to my job…