That’s why we should stop using them. If they have zero users, they’ll eventually stop the Fedora project and the Community can keep pace with Debian or openSuse. openSuse can easily step into Fedora and Red Hat’s shoes.
First of all you’ve swallowed the myth that Fedora users are beta testing for Enterprise software. That said discouraging people from voluntarily beta testing is bad for the community and fundamentally against the spirit of open source.
As a long-time Fedora user I think Red Hat’s backing is good for Fedora because it means they have a solid source of funding. Apart from the resources that gives them, that way they can be entirely user-centric and not be tempted to sell user data, run ads or anything else against the users’ interests.
There’s a lot of hearsay going on around Red Hat at the moment, some of it has grains of truth, some of it has been distorted beyond fact, I’m sorry that you’re a victim of it.
Beta testing is great. Just not when it’s for Red Hat(Fedora), Canonical, Microsoft (WSL) or any other Greedy Corp. when they are requesting this in the spirit of open source.
Not how open source works, you don’t get to choose who benefits from it, it’s for anyone who wants to use it. Ubuntu is downstream of Debian is it not?
Well Red Hat put up a paywall so that only those who they choose, can get the code. That’s the issue. Then they justified it by calling users who want the code “free loaders”. That’s typical proprietary speak, it has no place in open source.
Ubuntu is downstream of Debian. But canonical have taken it, forced snaps on users, forced opt out telemetry in users and removed default flatpak support. All very user hostile moves.
Hence I’m calling the community to show these corps we don’t need them and community distros have everything we need while protecting user freedom.
Why would this be a good thing at all? One of the main goals of the ecosystem is to have multiple choices, and as others in this thread has mentioned, Fedoras made significant progress for the adoption of Linux as a whole
Because you’d be helping Community distros get better, as well as financially, instead of supporting corporations that use you as beta testers to improve their paid corporate product and then screw you over when you want access to the server code.
I still don’t see how having the choice is a bad thing. If you don’t like Red Hats position, then don’t use Fedora. For those that believe using Fedora will help better the Open Source ecosystem, they have the ability to do so.
Getting rid of a choice completely because you don’t agree with a position in a nuanced conversation seems childish
I’m not saying it will be banned, you can still use it but I’m calling the community to return to community distros like Debian who are 100% libre and user freedom respecting… Plus there many dedicated developers and other volunteers who support this out of love for FOSS and the principles of free computing for all.
That’s not childish. It’s a call to get back to our roots. Use Community distros, volunteer your time if you have the skills they need, make a money donation to thank them and help the project keep going. That’s how FOSS is supposed to work.
OpenSuse is not going to break new ground. It’s all about OBS and testing software before it hits their Paid Enterprise offerings. And they have almost a fully automated procedure for this. OpenSuse is not going to push Wayland only nor what will become the standard. It’s not in their ethos. OpenSuse is there to build SLE’s next release.
Debian being cutting edge?! Never. Debian is Debian, very slow to adopt anything. Debian is about offering a very stable release schedule. Debian will never push the ecosystem forward, it’s not Debian’s goal. You want a reliable system that just works? Debian is inarguably the king.
Agree 100%. And both are 100% Community. openSuse is privately owned and supported by a massive Community.
Debian is perfect for reliability (although opensuse is very reliable) who don’t need the latest and don’t like installing updates all the time. 100% Community based.
Two fantastic, shining examples of the power of Community supported software 💪
That’s why we should stop using them. If they have zero users, they’ll eventually stop the Fedora project and the Community can keep pace with Debian or openSuse. openSuse can easily step into Fedora and Red Hat’s shoes.
That would be a very sad loss.
No. It’s what they deserve for screwing over the community. Let them pay for beta testers instead of getting free beta testing from the community
Try not to believe everything you read by random people online, Red Hat pays people to work on Fedora, you have no idea what you’re talking about.
I know they pay Fedora work because most of the employees ARE full time Red Hat employees.
Hence my point that the user is the free beta tester for Enterprise software.
Stop being a free beta tester for a Mega Corp that hates the Linux Community. Rather use Debian, Arch or another Community developed OS.
First of all you’ve swallowed the myth that Fedora users are beta testing for Enterprise software. That said discouraging people from voluntarily beta testing is bad for the community and fundamentally against the spirit of open source.
As a long-time Fedora user I think Red Hat’s backing is good for Fedora because it means they have a solid source of funding. Apart from the resources that gives them, that way they can be entirely user-centric and not be tempted to sell user data, run ads or anything else against the users’ interests.
There’s a lot of hearsay going on around Red Hat at the moment, some of it has grains of truth, some of it has been distorted beyond fact, I’m sorry that you’re a victim of it.
Beta testing is great. Just not when it’s for Red Hat(Fedora), Canonical, Microsoft (WSL) or any other Greedy Corp. when they are requesting this in the spirit of open source.
Rather beta test for Debian
Not how open source works, you don’t get to choose who benefits from it, it’s for anyone who wants to use it. Ubuntu is downstream of Debian is it not?
Well Red Hat put up a paywall so that only those who they choose, can get the code. That’s the issue. Then they justified it by calling users who want the code “free loaders”. That’s typical proprietary speak, it has no place in open source.
Ubuntu is downstream of Debian. But canonical have taken it, forced snaps on users, forced opt out telemetry in users and removed default flatpak support. All very user hostile moves.
Hence I’m calling the community to show these corps we don’t need them and community distros have everything we need while protecting user freedom.
Why would this be a good thing at all? One of the main goals of the ecosystem is to have multiple choices, and as others in this thread has mentioned, Fedoras made significant progress for the adoption of Linux as a whole
Because you’d be helping Community distros get better, as well as financially, instead of supporting corporations that use you as beta testers to improve their paid corporate product and then screw you over when you want access to the server code.
I still don’t see how having the choice is a bad thing. If you don’t like Red Hats position, then don’t use Fedora. For those that believe using Fedora will help better the Open Source ecosystem, they have the ability to do so.
Getting rid of a choice completely because you don’t agree with a position in a nuanced conversation seems childish
I’m not saying it will be banned, you can still use it but I’m calling the community to return to community distros like Debian who are 100% libre and user freedom respecting… Plus there many dedicated developers and other volunteers who support this out of love for FOSS and the principles of free computing for all.
That’s not childish. It’s a call to get back to our roots. Use Community distros, volunteer your time if you have the skills they need, make a money donation to thank them and help the project keep going. That’s how FOSS is supposed to work.
By the Community, for the Community 💪
OpenSuse has a very well defined pipeline:
Tumbleweed -> Leap (maybe Slowroll) -> SLE.
OpenSuse is not going to break new ground. It’s all about OBS and testing software before it hits their Paid Enterprise offerings. And they have almost a fully automated procedure for this. OpenSuse is not going to push Wayland only nor what will become the standard. It’s not in their ethos. OpenSuse is there to build SLE’s next release.
Debian being cutting edge?! Never. Debian is Debian, very slow to adopt anything. Debian is about offering a very stable release schedule. Debian will never push the ecosystem forward, it’s not Debian’s goal. You want a reliable system that just works? Debian is inarguably the king.
Agree 100%. And both are 100% Community. openSuse is privately owned and supported by a massive Community.
Debian is perfect for reliability (although opensuse is very reliable) who don’t need the latest and don’t like installing updates all the time. 100% Community based.
Two fantastic, shining examples of the power of Community supported software 💪