Kathoey are definitely not androgynous. They are explicitly living as women would, and present very feminine as shown. To varying degrees of success in passing, but it isn’t an issue. Nobody tells them they can’t be kathoey. They just are.
There is a lesser known opposite, Tom. As in, Tomboy. These are afab who essentially live as men. Less so than kathoey, I will say, presumably because society isn’t as ready for afab to play male roles. But they will wear short hair, dress masculine, and usually have relationships with with cis-women, known as "Dee (for “good (girl)” 🫤). When was there more than a decade ago at the start of social media really taking off, there was a high-society generational trend of cis-girls dating tomboys in their late teens, as a way to be safe from pregnancy/abuse while still being the cool girl who dates on Insta. You imagine this to be pretty sad at times for Toms who get abandoned as soon as said ciswomen are more stable in life.
They are explicitly living as women would, and present very feminine as shown
Degendering, or refusing to gender a trans person by only using neutral language such as they/them is an incredibly rude thing to do. It’s the equivalent of two siblings going “I’m not touchingmisgendering you!”. Obviously in the course of conversation using they/them makes sense for everyone in certain sentences. But at a certain point it’s just dehumanizing. I’m not non-binary, I’m a woman.
Next time your BF/GF is getting dressed up tell em how androgynous they are looking and see how well they take it…
I’m using the plural. Kathoey is both singular and plural in Thai. I would hope you’d also pick that up from “women”.
I’m also being careful not to equate 1-1 the kathoey identity with the transwoman identity. They aren’t the same, though the global conversation I am sure will eventually bring them closer.
Kathoey are definitely not androgynous. They are explicitly living as women would, and present very feminine as shown. To varying degrees of success in passing, but it isn’t an issue. Nobody tells them they can’t be kathoey. They just are.
There is a lesser known opposite, Tom. As in, Tomboy. These are afab who essentially live as men. Less so than kathoey, I will say, presumably because society isn’t as ready for afab to play male roles. But they will wear short hair, dress masculine, and usually have relationships with with cis-women, known as "Dee (for “good (girl)” 🫤). When was there more than a decade ago at the start of social media really taking off, there was a high-society generational trend of cis-girls dating tomboys in their late teens, as a way to be safe from pregnancy/abuse while still being the cool girl who dates on Insta. You imagine this to be pretty sad at times for Toms who get abandoned as soon as said ciswomen are more stable in life.
Degendering, or refusing to gender a trans person by only using neutral language such as they/them is an incredibly rude thing to do. It’s the equivalent of two siblings going “I’m not
touchingmisgendering you!”. Obviously in the course of conversation using they/them makes sense for everyone in certain sentences. But at a certain point it’s just dehumanizing. I’m not non-binary, I’m a woman.Next time your BF/GF is getting dressed up tell em how androgynous they are looking and see how well they take it…
I’m using the plural. Kathoey is both singular and plural in Thai. I would hope you’d also pick that up from “women”.
I’m also being careful not to equate 1-1 the kathoey identity with the transwoman identity. They aren’t the same, though the global conversation I am sure will eventually bring them closer.
You’re correct on both points and that’s my mistake.